tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post2999979663493440474..comments2024-01-04T07:05:27.381-06:00Comments on Immigration Talk with a Mexican American: Racial ProfilingDeehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comBlogger173125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-5324737953751060292007-09-18T11:01:00.000-05:002007-09-18T11:01:00.000-05:00Dee wants, "...a path to citizenship or Guest Work...Dee wants, "...a path to citizenship or Guest Worker status for the 12M here."<BR/><BR/>The question is, "Why?" Shouldn't we at least make some effort to determine who among the illegals has displaced an American worker by accepting a substandard wage? If their jobs can be filled by Americans , why shouldn't they be the first ones to be deported? That would be a more balanced approach. Any other will lead inevitably to Mexico North to the detriment of all Americans.ultimahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13624967903736347171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-4672143065154131532007-09-17T19:38:00.000-05:002007-09-17T19:38:00.000-05:00Secure I.D's? That's right, for U.S. citizens on...Secure I.D's? That's right, for U.S. citizens only.<BR/><BR/>Illegal aliens aren't in the shadows. They are all right out in the open<BR/><BR/>I have heard your ideas of Comprehensive Reform. I totally disagree. All illegal aiens need to go home either voluntarily or involuntarily, I don't care which.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-85091855643829592042007-09-17T19:14:00.000-05:002007-09-17T19:14:00.000-05:00Bob, You are so eloquent!Bob, You are so eloquent!Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-6958403898266644172007-09-17T19:13:00.000-05:002007-09-17T19:13:00.000-05:00Pat, Secure IDs are the answer. Additionally, we n...Pat, Secure IDs are the answer. Additionally, we need to have comprehensive immigration reform and bring the 12M out of the shadows, provide them secure IDs, deport the felonious criminals, the employers are required to recieve the secure IDs of these employees, all documented, on file.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-64656424259616368462007-09-17T16:09:00.000-05:002007-09-17T16:09:00.000-05:00Evidently some Hispanic citizens don't know the me...Evidently some Hispanic citizens don't know the meaning of the word xenophobic. It means having an unnatural fear of strangers. How does making the statement "a bunch of Mexicans" make one a xenophobic? Did this person express fear? NO! Racial profiling? Mexican isn't a race, it is a nationality. Many people refer to themselves and others not only by their race or ethnicity but by their nationality and the nationality of their ancestors. What racial profiling?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-4377717435569760212007-09-17T13:02:00.000-05:002007-09-17T13:02:00.000-05:00"Hispanic Citizen Response: 'Martin's comment show..."Hispanic Citizen Response: 'Martin's comment showed a "xenophobic mentality" that results in racial profiling.'"<BR/><BR/>American comment: Boo F'ing Hoo!<BR/><BR/>BobBobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09326495837644127734noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-90471436088905905102007-09-16T22:57:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:57:00.000-05:00I see you want the employers punished but the ille...I see you want the employers punished but the illegals rewarded with a path to citizenship. You think that is fair? I don't think so!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-21187216542482403612007-09-16T22:51:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:51:00.000-05:00I mentioned the article about the MM in that blog ...I mentioned the article about the MM in that blog just to prove that the blogger wasn't necessarily being honest about the Martin situation either. He/she is plainly biased and makes false accusations as they did about the MM.<BR/><BR/>Even if it gets proven that a couple of MM did vandalize a migrant camp that doesn't make them members of the KKK too. Nor does it make the whole organization of MMM, KKK'ers. <BR/><BR/>Let me ask you this, how do we sanction employers if we don't get proof of whether or not they have illegals on their payroll? The only way of getting that proof is raiding workplaces, gaining their records and questioning their employees. You want sanctions without proof of violations? You want the illegals to do what after the proof is found? Continue to work there anyway or detain and deport them as our laws demand? Here is an analogy for you. How do we convict a murderer without a body?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-36596804556405063932007-09-16T22:33:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:33:00.000-05:00Don't reference it then. That was 1954, this is 2...Don't reference it then. That was 1954, this is 2007 and it is called "Operation Return to Sender." If you want to complain about deportation of illegal aliens today then call it by what it is called today. No need to use that "Wetback" reference anymore to pull on emotional strings here. Not gonna happen anyway, as that is why we have ICE and they are doing the government's bidding of enforcing our immigration laws as they should be. None of their U.S. born citizen children will be deported as evidenced by the Elvira situation recently but hopefully their parents love them enough to take them back to their homeland with them so there will be no family separation. Mexico has dual citizenship and these U.S. born chilren can return when they are 18 or earlier if they have someone to care for them. But no illegal parent should gain legal status in this country just because they gave birth in our country. They created their own bad situation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-89236011732275884152007-09-16T22:28:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:28:00.000-05:00All, This has been a good discussion. I hope you u...All, This has been a good discussion. I hope you understand why this issue is so important and why Americans who are Hispanic are following this issue closely.<BR/> <BR/>We do not want to see the return of Operation Wetback. <BR/><BR/>Perhaps it is good this issue came up. People need to be study the Immigration issues and understand the impact on their own families. <BR/><BR/>As I continue to say, I am for secure borders, employer sanctions and a path to citizenship or Guest Worker status for the 12M here. I am adamently opposed to the return of Operation Wetback.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-17957639781921027582007-09-16T22:24:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:24:00.000-05:00Pat, Even though you are off topic re: MMs, appare...Pat, Even though you are off topic re: MMs, apparently you are not reading the news on the MMs. They have videos of their attacks on Migrant Camps and reports from a former MM who videotaped.<BR/><BR/>Here´s the news article.<BR/><A HREF="http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2007/08/15/news/top_stories/81407213243.txt" REL="nofollow">Videos depict Minutemen tearing down migrant camps </A>Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-15511825111820762452007-09-16T22:14:00.000-05:002007-09-16T22:14:00.000-05:00Pat, Obviously you did not read what I wrote. I re...Pat, Obviously you did not read what I wrote. I referenced <A HREF="http://www.pbs.org/kpbs/theborder/history/timeline/20.html" REL="nofollow">Operation Wetback</A>. <BR/><BR/>It WILL NOT happen again!!Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-17352682092254308832007-09-16T19:38:00.000-05:002007-09-16T19:38:00.000-05:00dee, why do you refer to Mexicans as Wetbacks? D...dee, why do you refer to Mexicans as Wetbacks? Don't you know that your people don't like that word? It went out back in the 50's and that is why our government doesn't use that word anymore when referring to the deportation of illegal aliens from Mexico. They call it "Operation Return to Sender" now. See no more, Wetback references. You are the one keeping that offensive word alive. Oh, thats right you are the one who doesn't like Hispanic citizens being called Mexicans either even though you call yourself a Mexican American. We are all so confused since you change the rules all the time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-75284571589513558412007-09-16T19:17:00.000-05:002007-09-16T19:17:00.000-05:00There is a difference between disagreeing with one...There is a difference between disagreeing with one's stance on illegal immigration and flat out lying and stating that the MM are members of the KKK. You never seem to mind any name calling and lies geared towards those who are for the rule of law in this country but you are quick to scream foul if any negative remarks are made about illegal aliens, even if they are based on facts!<BR/><BR/>You went bonkers when this Martin person called a group of workers who were Hispanic just a bunch of Mexicans (could have meant their ancestry only) and said that he GUESSED that some were illegal aliens and yet you condone the MM being called KKK'ers? You sure do like to operate on hypocricy and double standards, don't you?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-59901732763692286762007-09-16T19:00:00.000-05:002007-09-16T19:00:00.000-05:00What you ANTIs are going to find out is, we Americ...What you ANTIs are going to find out is, we Americans will NOT allow Operation Wetback will never happen again.<BR/><BR/>People like Martin have awoken the sleeping, gentle, accomodating Giant.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-57723074845062143612007-09-16T18:58:00.000-05:002007-09-16T18:58:00.000-05:00Pat, What this proves is their is more than one si...Pat, What this proves is their is more than one side to the Immigration Debate.<BR/><BR/>There are plenty of Blogs and plenty of view points. The ANTIs do not have a monopoly on viewpoints. <BR/><BR/>In America, we can have various viewpoints and each of us can post them on our blogs.<BR/><BR/>More and more PROs are coming out and speaking theri opinions and their perspectives. <BR/><BR/>I say Hurray for the American Way!!<BR/>Hurray for Freedom of Speech!!Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-52145257622692791872007-09-16T18:32:00.000-05:002007-09-16T18:32:00.000-05:00liquid, if you scroll down past the Martin article...liquid, if you scroll down past the Martin article by this KC blogger, his next article is titled, "The Klu Klux Minutemen are coming to town." Very telling how biased and what a liar this blogger is with a statement like that.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-79652873387975752152007-09-16T18:07:00.000-05:002007-09-16T18:07:00.000-05:00No need to dispute.He admitted the deed.Now he is ...No need to dispute.<BR/><BR/>He admitted the deed.<BR/><BR/>Now he is Lady Macbeth.<BR/><BR/>"Out Out Damn Spot!!"Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-18355817208544432202007-09-16T17:54:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:54:00.000-05:00There are measures in place to prevent 'Operation ...There are measures in place to prevent 'Operation Wetback' from occurring again, I already gave them to you earlier.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-70982610932738049702007-09-16T17:53:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:53:00.000-05:00I just numbered the FACTS in order, taken from all...I just numbered the FACTS in order, taken from all the links provided in the above responses and placed them in order. <BR/><BR/>Dispute them if you can!!!!<BR/><BR/>City officials agree with Martin. City officials are not the Gov. office from which Martin was representing. <BR/><BR/>If you want to blame anybody for racial comments, blame Hennessey for his earlier remarks, not Martin. <BR/><BR/>Your Hispanic opposer's couldn't even quote Martin correctly, they do as you do, embellish what was said to try to further their cause. Nothing like habitual lying on yours and your Hispanic opposer's behalf's.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-53849465503667432532007-09-16T17:49:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:49:00.000-05:00And the most telling is you Liquid, and Pat and An...And the most telling is you Liquid, and Pat and Anon and Ulty all want Operation Wetback resurrected as well.<BR/><BR/>Civil liberties be damned say you.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-15619052625147044062007-09-16T17:47:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:47:00.000-05:00Well, I see you copied the article I posted. As I ...Well, I see you copied the article I posted. <BR/><BR/>As I said, the Gov is pulling in every favor in order to get his someone-anyone to back up the Martin. This is the Cover Up I mentioned earlier.<BR/><BR/>The TRANSCRIPTS have the truth. Martin said:<BR/><BR/>"I’ll tell you what’s available, is every frigging developer can figure out who is illegal, and when he says like he told them them there’s a bunch of Mexicans out there, I guess some of them are probably not legal." <BR/><BR/>These are the FACTS.<BR/>This is in the Transcripts.<BR/>The table thumping, red faced anger drive to resurrect Operation Wetback.<BR/><BR/>Now the Gov is getting all his cronies in an attempt to cover up Martins rants.<BR/><BR/>Its not always the crime that gets them. Its the cover up.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-87685250150802186712007-09-16T17:19:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:19:00.000-05:001) The incident in question happened at a meeting ...1) The incident in question happened at a meeting in Jefferson City, when the Missouri Housing Development Commission grilled the lawyer for a St. Charles County housing project.<BR/><BR/>Pete Hennessey, of Hennessey Development of Clayton, has come under fire for allegedly hiring a subcontractor with illegal immigrant workers. Hennessey has insisted he is free of any wrongdoing.<BR/><BR/>His lawyer, David Lang, was addressing the commission. Lang said Hennessey had been "proactive" in checking employees' immigration status. Lang then mentioned that one federal database that employers use "is only a couple weeks old. So this isn't something he would have been able to …"<BR/><BR/>That's when Martin interrupted, telling Lang not to talk about the database's availability.<BR/><BR/>"I’ll tell you what’s available, is every frigging developer can figure out who is illegal, and when he says (he = Hennessey)- like he told them (he = Hennessey; them = Missouri Housing Development Commission) - there’s a bunch of Mexicans out there, I guess some of them are probably not legal," Martin said, according to a transcript of the meeting.<BR/><BR/>2) Jim Torres, the commission’s secretary and legislative liaison, sent Blunt a letter Wednesday (Sept. 5, 2007) taking offense at Martin’s "inflammatory comment" and asking the governor to order Martin to publicly apologize at the commission’s September meeting. Torres said he was the grandson of Mexican immigrants and noted his uncles and father all served in the U.S. military.<BR/><BR/>"I am extremely proud of my Mexican heritage, culture and especially my family and I will not let anyone demean or degrade it, least of all Mr. Martin," Torres wrote.<BR/><BR/>3) Ramsel, who was at the August meeting, said he did not initially recall Martin’s remark. But after reading the transcript, Ramsel concurred with Martin’s explanation that it appeared to address the alleged use of illegal workers at that particular O’Fallon work site.<BR/><BR/>4) Torres files formal complaint. Ramsel said he saw a draft of Torres letter before it was sent and thought it was inappropriate for Torres to complain to Blunt about Martin while signing the letter in his official capacity, instead of as a private citizen.<BR/><BR/>"I told him it was his choice, but I did not encourage it," Ramsel said.<BR/><BR/>5) Torres resigned Sept. 6, 2007.<BR/><BR/>6) In a letter the same day, Martin thanked Ramsel for calling him about Torres’ comments in the letter to Blunt. Martin’s letter said Torres was “both unprofessional and inappropriate.”<BR/><BR/>Martin wrote that his remark was directed only at the O’Fallon development, "where illegal workers from Mexico were at issue."<BR/><BR/>"I was paraphrasing what I had been told there and acknowledge I could have been clearer," Martin wrote. "I certainly meant no harm to Jim or anyone else."<BR/><BR/>Martin said his comments during the meeting were meant to convey the idea that too many developers and contractors are ignoring the law when it comes to illegal workers.<BR/><BR/>Martin said later that he was paraphrasing remarks the developer had made during a meeting with O’Fallon officials. The DEVELOPER PURPORTEDLY ACKNOWLEDGED that there very well might be illegal workers at the construction site.<BR/><BR/>7) According to Bob Lowery, the O’Fallon city administrator who attended the meeting with the developer, Martin’s use of the words “bunch of Mexicans” precisely mirrored those of the developer’s. O’Fallon’s mayor, Donna Morrow, also was at the meeting and confirmed that Martin’s paraphrasing was accurate.<BR/><BR/>Ramsel, who was at the August meeting, said he did not initially recall Martin’s remark. But after reading the transcript, Ramsel concurred with Martin’s explanation that it appeared to address the alleged use of illegal workers at that particular O’Fallon work site.<BR/><BR/>"Mr. Martin was responding to a developer he thought was making excuses," Blunt said Monday at a news conference in St. Louis.<BR/><BR/>8) But some Hispanic leaders aren’t satisfied with that explanation.<BR/><BR/>Nothing short of Martin’s firing and an apology from the governor’s office will suffice, said Rita Valenciano, president of the Coalition of Hispanic Organizations, who was joined by other Kansas City-area Hispanic leaders at a news conference.<BR/><BR/>"This statement made by the chief of staff and the governor’s office in 2007 makes it one of the most profiling and racist statements to come from the governor’s office in recent history in Missouri," she said.<BR/><BR/>Valenciano drew little distinction between whether Martin was speaking on his own behalf or paraphrasing a developer at the hearing. She said that even if Martin were paraphrasing the comments of someone else, he should have gone out of his way to distance himself and Blunt’s office from suggesting that some Mexicans at work sites are likely to be illegal immigrants.<BR/><BR/>The Hispanic leaders accused Martin of making a racist implication that any group of Mexican-appearing people probably includes illegal immigrants.<BR/>At times Monday, Hispanic leaders misquoted Martin.<BR/>In the news release issued by Valenciano, Martin was incorrectly quoted as saying “where there are Mexican (looking people) — you are likely to find illegals.”<BR/>Then at the news conference later that day, Valenciano quoted Martin incorrectly again, saying he had said “frigging Mexican” people.<BR/>When reminded that Martin said “frigging developers,” she said she did not have a transcript of the meeting in front of her.<BR/>9) Torres is on paid vacation pending his official resignation on Sept. 20. On Tuesday, he declined to say whether he resigned as a result of Martin’s remark.<BR/><BR/>10) "I find it ironic that Mr. Martin would characterize my comments in my letter of Sept. 5, 2007, as `both unprofessional and inappropriate,’" Torres said. "I think anyone in attendance at the Aug. 27, 2007, commission meeting would find his inflammatory comments and behavior in a public meeting extremely unprofessional and inappropriate for someone representing the governor of the state." (Mr. Torres can’t even get the date right of Aug. 17, 2007?)<BR/><BR/>11) Blunt spokeswoman Jessica Robinson stressed that "no one meant any harm to Mr. Torres" and noted the director of the housing commission "felt compelled to apologize to our office for his former employee’s claims."<BR/><BR/>12) Pete Ramsel, director of the housing commission, said Jim Torres, the legislative liaison and secretary for the commission, left voluntarily. Torres’ resignation, expressed in a Sept. 6 letter, is effective Sept. 20.<BR/>“I think everybody needs to know he was not asked to resign,” Ramsel said Thursday. “It was Jim’s decision.”<BR/>Ramsel’s comments came a day after Hispanic leaders in St. Louis and state Democrats suggested Torres was fired for daring to protest comments made by Ed Martin, Gov. Matt Blunt’s chief of staff. Hispanic groups said the comments were racist, but Martin said he was merely paraphrasing what someone else said.<BR/><BR/>13) Rep. Timothy Flook, R-Liberty, who is of Hispanic heritage, said Martin's comments don't seem racist to him.<BR/>"I classify them as indelicate but I did not read them as a straight out racist comment," Flook said.<BR/>Flook said he doesn't think Martin should be fired.<BR/>"I agree with their passion and their beliefs, but I can't say I agree it's a call for resignation or apologies," Flook said.<BR/> Flook is a second generation Mexican American.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-8202303437284451852007-09-16T17:13:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:13:00.000-05:00dee you are running amuck again, let's see how man...dee you are running amuck again, let's see how many of those workers are illegal. I have no doubt that many are illegal aliens, not legal immigrants or American citizens. You should put your anger towards the 12 million plus illegal aliens who are mostly from mexico. <BR/><BR/>anon1Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5548695401579410439.post-40701708358514797172007-09-16T17:04:00.000-05:002007-09-16T17:04:00.000-05:00You certainly have a lot of excuses for your persp...You certainly have a lot of excuses for your perspective. You always have an angle or an excuse. The governor sent out his go-fers to do his bidding and they are attempting to cover up. <BR/><BR/>You know what they say. It isn´t the crime that does them in. It is the cover up. The Gov and Martin will get their due in the end.<BR/><BR/>This has gone far and is much too public. The Just are seeking Justice.<BR/><BR/>The truth will stand tall.<BR/><BR/>Once Martin resigns and admits his errors, I expect an apology from you, but I promise, I won´t hold my breath waiting for it.Deehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09583438645860375661noreply@blogger.com