Sunday, February 10, 2008

ANTIs Mayberrian Dream Turns into Downtown Reality

The following are two news articles. The 1st is a news article from Oklahoma. The 2nd is a news article from Arizona.
In November, Oklahoma passed a restrictionist Immigration law which included verbiage indicating transporting illegal immigrants is a crime. This resulted in Racial Profiling. As a result, a vast number of Hispanics, both legal and illegal, are leaving the State. As businesses are going out of business, lawmakers are looking to rescind the law. This law was originally pushed forward by the Minutemen and introduced by Republican Randy Terrill. Arizona´s restrictionist laws go into effect March 1.
Oklahoma: Tulsa World Reports
U.S. Chamber fights 1804 By OMER GILLHAM World Staff Writer 2/2/2008
It's joined other associations suing Oklahoma over the immigration reform law.

OKLAHOMA CITY -- The U.S. Chamber of Commerce has joined forces with the Oklahoma City and Tulsa chambers to sue the state over its immigration reform law. The U.S. Chamber filed for an injunction Friday in U.S. District Court for the Western District of Oklahoma. The lawsuit targets specific aspects of House Bill 1804. Among other things, the new law creates state barriers to hiring illegal immigrants, requires proof of citizenship to receive certain government benefits and makes it illegal to knowingly transport illegal immigrants. Through the injunction, the U.S. Chamber is seeking to stop the implementation of two sections of the measure. The lawsuit challenges a requirement that employers doing business with the state use the federal government's voluntary experimental program for verifying work eligibility. It also challenges require ments for businesses to verify the work authorization status of individual independent contractors to avoid state tax penalties. The injunction alleges that the challenged sections of the law are pre-empted by federal law and are unconstitutional under the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution. In a prepared statement, the U.S. Chamber said: "The organizations supporting the in junction explained that the lawsuit focuses on those provisions of HB 1804 which impose unreasonable burdens on Oklahoma businesses and puts them at a disadvantage compared to competitors in other states, and that HB 1804 puts businesses in the impossible position of having to comply with conflicting federal and state laws."

Arizona - Fox News Reports:
AGIA PRIETA, Mexico — For the first time, Mexican officials in Arizona admit there is hard evidence illegal immigrants are preparing to leave the state because a new employer sanctions law is making it difficult, if not impossible, for them to keep a job. Illegal immigrants are flooding the Mexican consulate in Phoenix for documents that will allow them to return to Mexico to enroll their children in school, the consul to Arizona, Carlos Flores Vizcarra, told FOX News. They are also requesting a document called "menaje de casa," which allows illegal immigrant families living in the U.S. to cross into Mexico without paying a tax on their furniture and personal belongings. Vizcarra said 94 families asked the embassy for students transfer documents last month, compared to only three last year. He said several thousand immigrants asked for the tax document. In a separate interview, Edmundo Hidalgo of the non-profit immigrant support group Chicanos Por La Causa, said 30,000 illegal immigrants said in a survey last week that they planned to leave Arizona sometime before March 1, when the state’s tough new employer sanctions law goes into effect. Under the law, employers can lose their business licenses if they hire undocumented workers.
Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio has set up a hotline for citizens to report on employers who hire illegals. He has said enforcement will begin when the law goes into effect. Many deputies have also been given arrest authority by Customs and Border Protection to enforce federal immigration law. So in the course of a traffic stop, illegal immigrants without a driver's license could ultimately face deportation.
These factors, combined with a slowing economy, are forcing many undocumented workers to consider leaving Arizona. According to a study last year, 12 percent of Arizona’s workforce is in the U.S. illegally, the highest percentage in the nation. At a immigrant shelter in Agua Prieta, Mexico, just south of the Arizona border, officials say illegal immigrants are leaving the Grand Canyon state because of the employer sanctions law. In the last month, for every five immigrants trying to enter the U.S., four were crossing back in the other direction, said Rosa Soto Moreno, who runs a Catholic shelter that provides food and lodging for illegal immigrants. Soto said illegal immigrants crossing back into Mexico is a new phenomenon, and she attributes it to the new law. "Many of the supervisors are upset by the law, but have told their workers they have no choice," she said.

As the saying goes, "Be careful what you ask for. You might just get it. Not Downtown Mayberry, rather Downtown Reality!"


patriot said...

The "fictional" town of Mayberry was a flourishing, community minded town bound together by Americans of common interests, a common language and a respect for the law. You have a problem with that, dee?

The MM have no power to push any legislation through. You are bound and determned to attack the MM at every turn, arent' you? All the while disregarding the racist agenda of the NCLR, Mecha, Lulac and other Hispanic advocacy groups.

The newly adopted immgiration laws in some states are not unduly harsh. Notice the part where you state "transporting illegals KNOWINGLY". All one would have to say is "I didn't know they were illegal". The law would have to prove their guilt and that would be hard to do. You do like to exaggerate, don't you? Other than that part of the Oklahoma and Arizona bills what is wrong with the rest of it? Why should they give public assistance to illegals? It also against federal law for employers to hire illegals. What is your problem with that part of it? You don't sound like a loyal American at all objecting to the enforcement of our immigration laws.

How many times do we have to go over your so-called claims of racial profling? If the majority of illegals in this country are Latinos, there is nothing unusual for law enforcement to question them more than others. If you are not here illegally you have nothing to fear. Now, are you going to repeat this same nonsense one, two, three weeks from now?

Good, if the illegals are leaving these states then their newly adopted laws are working. I hope it catches on all over the nation and they will go back to their homelands where they belong. We will survive. We even survived a depression long ago and many recessions. This country isn't going to fall off the face of the earth with the exit of illegal aliens. We are a nation of laws and legal immigration. Not uncontrolled illegal immigration with foreigners thumbing their noses at our laws.

Liquidmicro said...

The only businesses that are being 'impacted' in downtown reality are those that cater to the 'Illegal Alien' population. As for the lawsuit, "puts them at a disadvantage compared to competitors in other states", is rather broad brushing since most companies, i.e. construction, landscaping, etc., do not compete in other states and companies from other states must abide by OK's law, so really, where is there any disadvantage? E-verify has already been used in court and it has won, mandating the use.

From OK, “The state of Oklahoma ought not be in the business of subsidizing the presence of people who are here illegally.”

On Thursday, a federal judge in Arizona ruled against a lawsuit by construction contractors and immigrant organizations who sought to halt a state law that went into effect on Jan. 1 imposing severe penalties on employers who knowingly hire illegal immigrants. The judge, Neil V. Wake of Federal District Court, methodically rejected all of the contractors’ arguments that the Arizona law invaded legal territory belonging exclusively to the federal government.

On Jan. 31, a federal judge in Missouri, E. Richard Webber, issued a similarly broad and even more forcefully worded decision in favor of an ordinance aimed at employers of illegal immigrants adopted by Valley Park, Mo., a city on the outskirts of St. Louis.

And, in an even more sweeping ruling in December, a judge in Oklahoma, James H. Payne, threw out a lawsuit against a state statute enacted last year requiring state contractors to verify new employees’ immigration status. Judge Payne said the immigrants should not be able to bring their claims to court because they were living in the country in violation of the law.

"Soto said illegal immigrants crossing back into Mexico is a new phenomenon", why do think Calderon is here pushing for the US to grant legality and allow all who wish to come here for work to be able to? It keeps Mexico in the "$$$$$$GREEN$$$$$", while Mexico's Government gets rich off of American Citizens and Mexico's 'innocent' workers sending monies back to Mexico. Let Mexico solve its problems, there Government has lived off America for far to long, lets hold Mexico's Government accountable now.

dianne said...

I would imagine the reason legal citizens are leaving those states is because someone in their household is illegal and they have decided they don't want to risk the whole family running afoul of the law so they are all leaving at once.

I have no NONE sympathy for the greedy employers and hope they throw the book at them.

Dee said...

Liquid I disagree with your statement. Many businesses are being impacted. Tulsa is turning into Downtown Reality! Why do you think ALL of those groups are involved. This is just the beginning of the end for Tulsa if these laws stay enforced.

The benefit from all this is Tulsa and Oklahoma are serving as a test site for all other states to see and study.

Liquid´s statement:
The only businesses that are being 'impacted' in downtown reality are those that cater to the 'Illegal Alien' population.

Dee said...

Dianne, People are also leaving because of the racial profiling. Pat seems to think it is ok to be racially profiled. I don´t. Can you imagine having to be stopped all the time by the police just because you have brown skin? According to the comments in the Tulsa newspapers, not only Hispanics but Native Americans are being racially profiled as well.

This is deplorable!

Anonymous said...


Tulsa is thriving - the number of new businesses is growing rapidly

and these new businesses are hiring from the large group of citizens that were unemployed in 2007.

These unemployed citizens are now getting jobs

Dee, the workers in tulsa love this new law - if you set up your blog to let me post photos i will do so - i will drive around and take photos of all the new places opening up-

Dee, if you were a citizen working part time at mcdonalds last year and suddenly all the higher end restaurants came aggressively looking ofr kitchen staff, how would you feel? you would be thrilled you could suddenly start making higher wages.

Dee, what is the problem, do you personally know anyone that works at mcdonalds or home depot or any other extrememely low wage job - do you talk to them? how can you not love it when there is a severe labor shortage and the boss man has to come begging?

Anonymous said...


the higher wages are taking hold in Phoenix right now as well

here is the quote from the news

Ironco has raised steel fitters' wages 30 percent from a year ago, according to Bailey. "We've raised wages, competing for a diminishing supply (of workers)," he said. "WeÂ’ve been on a campaign of quality improvement, training, scouring the waterfront, so to speak, for American vets, ex-offenders trying to find their way back into society."


Dee, i think you are loyal to america and loyal to workers trying to get the boss to pay them more. In my hear i think that when you see the wages for good honest salt of the earth hard working us citizens going up in oklahoma and arizona, you will reconsider your view.

it may not happen fast, but it will happen. I will keep sending you stories and articles about hardworking us citizens who are starting to get more jobs and get more money thanks to these laws

Liquidmicro said...

House Bill 1804: Legal vs. moral?

Even from OK they are not seeing what Dee is talking about.

"Tillie Sewell, of Enid Hispanic Council, said the law has made many Hispanics more reserved and reclusive within the community.

“They now feel that they don’t need to draw attention to themselves,” Sewell said. “Many feel that they can’t be active in the community. They are turning to the church for sanctuary.”

Sewell also said the law has created a situation in which Hispanics have reservations about displaying their heritage. She has not seen many Hispanic residents leaving the area, though.

Much of the issue involves the work place. Employers can be held liable for hiring illegal immigrants.

Victor Rosario, of Advance Food Co., doesn’t feel this is something that is wrong. Rosario said he believes the bill will help reduce the amount of crime and gang activity in the Hispanic community and create more jobs for legal citizens, which is one of its main purposes.

“As long as we have programs and companies like Advance Food bringing jobs into the community, I don’t see a problem with it,” Rosario said."

The benefits for American Citizens from the same article.
"“Several legal citizens are not receiving the money they need for things like health care, because it is going to people who are in our country illegally,” Jackson said.

Jackson said he believes there were things in the bill that need to be tweaked and refined to make it stronger, but the majority of the response he has gotten from the community has been favorable.

“The main purpose of the bill is provide a social safety net for legal citizens,” he said. “It is attempting to decrease unemployment in the state and get more people in the pipeline.”

The bill has taken away money that was providing benefits and scholarships for illegal immigrants and given it to legal citizens in need, he said. The city of Enid has a 3 percent unemployment rate, and he said one of the biggest things the bill is helping with is getting skilled workers into jobs in the community."

I have a question for you, Dee, are you a Globalist or a Nationalist? Or, if you believe you are both, in which order do you place them?

Liquidmicro said...

Dee, when was the last time you drove through or visited either Oklahoma, Tulsa in particular, or Arizona? Anon seems to live in Oklahoma, my parents have just left my aunts house in Oklahoma, and nothing you are stating is even close to what Anon or my Aunt seem to be seeing. Since you are in your gated community in Dallas, why not take a trip north up 35 to Tulsa or Oklahoma City and post the pictures back on your web. And since racial profile is going on, you should have a pretty good chance of being pulled over, video tape it and show it to all of us, I will bet we all would then agree with you. Until then......

Anonymous said...

yes - Dee - i second that last comment

drive up to Oklahoma city - it should be only a 4 hour drive if you do it on a weekend - go to the bricktown canal, there are more than a dozen restaurants there. Just go around out back and talk to the kitchen staff hanging out back behind the restaurants, taking a smoke or whatever. Just listen to their stories - there are hundreds of them - they will tell you that thanks to the new law their wages have been raised

i tell you to go there cause it is a safe area, and they are used to out of town folks wandering around so you won't be out of place in any way.

People of all races work in these restaurants and you can talk to all of them. I think you will walk away with a good sense of how the laws are working out.

You will be hard pressed to find a single hardworking person that is not wildly in favor of this law.

Now if you instead go to the front of the house and talk to the manager of these restaurants he will tell you a different story , about how much he hates the law, how hard it is to get workers etc

Dee, spend some time - ok city is really close to you. Talk to the people. Then on your drive back to Dallas, ask yourself "whose side am i on"

Liquidmicro said...

National spotlight on 'poster child' illegal immigration case

Just the type of companies that are being 'Impacted' by 'Illegal Aliens'. Nothing like exploiting a few fellow brothers of your own country, now is there?

patriot said...

dee, you are one of the most ridiculous people I have ever encountered. 1. You don't think that employers that had illegal aliens on their payroll should be impacted negatively with the illegals leaving? They deserve it don't they? What happened to your advocacy for employer sanctions all of a sudden? Is money obtained thru corruption more important to you than the rule of law?

2. Every person with brown skin is not going to be stopped all the time for no reason at all and asked for I.D. You know that is a big fat lie! Let me ask you about your so-called racial profiling claim. If a white male has committed a crime, who do you think that the police should females? Get real, dee. Your exaggerations are just a way for you to try to gain sympathy for illegal aliens. It's not going to work!

Anonymous said...


i am afraid that the words of Patriot will distract you from answering my humble request that you drive to Ok city and talk to the dozens of restaurant workers hanging out at the bricktown canal - don't go an a day that there is a game at the stadium - will be too busy - go on a regular weekend day, in between lunchtime and dinner time - plenty of good people of all races hanging out behind the restaurants ready to talk to you

it might be fun for you to bash patriot but why not focus on doing something to expand the knowledge around here - expand the thinking rather than drive the same tired ground

dianne said..., I don't agree with racial profiling, but I've been checked out almost every job I've ever had. I've even had credit and criminal checks run on me by my last company. I didn't think anything of it. I've also had to provide a valid social security card to get a passport along with a lot of information and wait weeks to get the passport. I can't see a doctor without telling them everything there is about me, including questions about my sex life (no kidding..can you believe that was on the questionnaire in the docs office!!). If I was arrested for any reason, I would not be offended if asked to prove my citizenship.

I will say this. I've been to Mexico a couple of times and I've also been to various countries in Europe. I was very aware of the necessity to keep my passport close at hand and I felt somewhat intimidated a couple of times, especially in Germany. It's not a pleasant feeling, but hey it's the law. I can't just barge into their country with the proper papers.

All that said, I believe the focus needs to be on criminals and on employers. Kansas is currently looking at new laws similar to Oklahoma and already the lobbyists for the businesses are hollering. I have had conversations with both my legislators about this and that their number 1 priority should be employer enforcement. That's the reason we have most of the illegal immigration we do and that's the number 1 way to stop it.

Anonymous said...


i agree with you a million percent

however, employer enforcement won't ensure justice for all.

in my town, most of the undocumented work as nannies and cleaning people - they are not working for big bad companies - they are working for families , neighbors

there is of course no way to punish the average homeowner for hiring an undocumented nanny or cleaning person

even if there were plenty of sanctions on companies, as long as landlords will rent to the undocumented, and they can find jobs as nannies and cleaning people they will keep on coming

Dee said...

Tulsa is thriving? Show me one news article from a reputable newspaper that says so. Pat, did you read your article? Here is the 1st paragraph:

'Hispanic panic' as Arizona immigration crackdown bites
Sat Jan 26, 3:47 AM ET
PHOENIX, Arizona (AFP) - One month after Arizona introduced a law cracking down on businesses which employ illegal immigrants, Latino workers are fleeing the state and companies are laying off employees in droves, officials and activists say.

Businesses are temporarily raising wages to entice workers, as they did in NJ.

You ANTIs continue to live in your dream world, hoping for Mayberry.

Dee said...

I go to Tulsa a couple of times a year. I told you that. I go to their Casino and visit with friends. Tulsa takes me in as one of their own. (Native American) I know exactly what is happening in Tulsa.

Dee said...

Liquid, Thanks for the link to the news article. I just wrote the very biased author and gave him some feedback. Hmmm...

Dee said...

Stormfront member Sewell probably is glad to see the Hispanics in the area become more reserved and reclusive. Anything to avoid the racial profiling.

"Tillie Sewell, of Enid Hispanic Council, said the law has made many Hispanics more reserved and reclusive within the community.

Dee said...

Anon, Give me a break. You do not live in Tulsa. I think you live in California or Texas. Spill the truth!!
I go up to Tulsa all the time!

Dee said...

Liquid and Anon,

I am studying the issues every day. I am reading the OK newspapers every day.

It really tears you apart, doesn´t it. It really tears you apart that you are wrong. It tears you apart that the Mass Deportation of illegal immigrants in a community destroys the community. We have seen it in NJ. We have seen it in Oklahoma. We will see it in Arizona.

Half of this is due to the nativist groups like Minutemen and others who insist on restrictionist laws imposed which promote racial profiling.

We need to study what is happening in Oklahoma and in Arizona. We need to study the impact and see what will happen to our great nation if the 12M are mass deported.

Let Oklahoma serve as a Case Study. The results will illustrate themselves.

patriot said...

dee, I didn't post any article. But as the article says these employers are now seeking out Americans workers at higher wages. This is a bad thing?

What is it with you and the Mayberrian term? Are you suggesting that it is wrong for White Americans to live in neighborhoods and cities together just like the Mexicans do? You have a double standard? Do you hate White citizens and their right to be bound together by a common language and culture and live in a majority White neighborhood but it is ok for Hispanics to do so? Sounds racist to me. I know of many neighborhoods and cities that are majority Hispanic. What should we call them....Barrioian?

Liquidmicro said...

There you go again with who is right and who is wrong. Neither are right and neither are wrong. You only read and see in an article what it is you want to read and see. From the same article, I can have a different read and see what I wish. Again, if it doesn't conform to what you want or what you see, they/we/us are labeled as wrong. Now, answer the question: are you a Globalist or a Nationalist? Or, if you believe you are both, in which order do you place them?

patriot said...

No dee, we are happy about what is happening. We are enforcing our immigration laws and returning to a nation of laws. The illegals are leaving the areas where this is happening. Why wouldn't you want that as a so-called loyal American?

No citizen community is being destroyed, they are coming back vibrant and more healthy. We should as "loyal" Americans insist on being nativist about our country just like the Mexicans in Mexico are. Laws are always restrictionist in nature. That is why they are called laws, they are in place to protect Americans.

Why bring up the MM again? They have no special power. They are merely U.S. citizens voicing their opinions just like you or I do. Are you looking for someone to blame now? And for what? Getting our immigration laws enforce for once? You are one of the most transparent people I have ever encountered. You wear your racism on your lapel like a medal of honor.

Anonymous said...

Dee said...
Anon, Give me a break. You do not live in Tulsa. I think you live in California or Texas. Spill the truth!!

Dee, i do live in Tulsa. I have constantly offered to do WHATEVER the heck you ask me to in order to prove that i live in Tulsa.

you accuse me of being a liar - why the heck don't you test me out by having me go run an errand or something here in Tulsa - want me to photograph something? just give me the ability to post it to your blog and i will do so.

again, you accuse me of not living in tulsa - give me a chance to prove i do without having to give you my name and address (which i am a little concerned to do considering the tone of this debate)

Again, Dee i tell you that i live in Tulsa and frequently visit OK city. I tell you that the restaurants here are raising wages for american citizens of all races - black, white, latino. Citizens are smiling ear to ear due to these high wages

You accuse me of being a liar - allow me to prove to this entire board that i am in Tulsa - in fact i'd love to have a feature on the fine restaurants and other places that are hiring workers. Things are really booming for workers here

Anonymous said...


the article below says that the take home pay of citizens is going up as a result of the law - how can you look at one of these workers getting higher pay and not be moved

Ironco has raised steel fitters' wages 30 percent from a year ago, according to Bailey. "We've raised wages, competing for a diminishing supply (of workers)," he said. "WeÂ’ve been on a campaign of quality improvement, training, scouring the waterfront, so to speak, for American vets, ex-offenders trying to find their way back into society."

Liquidmicro said...

Dee said...

Stormfront member Sewell probably is glad to see the Hispanics in the area become more reserved and reclusive. Anything to avoid the racial profiling.

Tillie Sewell is a member of Stormfront???? And your proof is???? I find her here: Tillie Sewell, Secretary
Hispanic Outreach Council

Of: PEGASYS, Inc., Community Access Television.

And I find her here: I thoroughly enjoy watching the program and keep-up each week and call in my vote. But for the life of me I can't understand why the music that is chosen does not fit the dance! I'm a Latina and love to dance, I have won a contest or two with my husband. Can you give me the rationale?

Tillie Sewell, Enid, OK (Sent Thursday, April 19, 2007 3:29 PM)

I believe you are grasping at straws hoping that no research is done. Sorry, you know I research my info very well.

Liquidmicro said...

Your reference to Sewell is to Linda Sewell of Mobile Alabama. Here is the stormfront link. Alabama Woman alleges harassment by SPLC...

You can now take your foot out of your mouth, and realize that you are not always 'right' with your assumptions.

Anonymous said...

Dee said...
Anon, Give me a break. You do not live in Tulsa. I think you live in California or Texas. Spill the truth!!]
Hello dee - you said that i don't live in tulsa - i am standing by - how can i demonstrate the truth - perhaps a few photos of any tulsa restaurant you can name - i can walk in to the kitchen and photo all the citizens who now tell me they can get jobs that weren't available to them before

Anonymous said...

Dee -

hello from Tulsa !

Where wages are going up and unemployment is going down thanks to the new law.

You now have a reporter on the ground to report on all the great things for workers of all races that are going on here

Anonymous said...


there are plenty of us normal working people on your board, hanging around with people of all races, just trying to get paid fairly by the boss.

We here in Tulsa are finding higher wages and better treatment from the boss thanks to the new law here.

all i hear from you is accusations that i don't really live in Tulsa

well here i am - I have yet to meet a working person here in Tulsa that hasn't heard of some higher wages due to the new law -

all i hear from you is accusations that i don't live in tulsa

What's going on Dee, a little of that big Texas snobbery towards the little people like me in Oklahoma -

You wrote -

Dee said...
Anon, Give me a break. You do not live in Tulsa. I think you live in California or Texas. Spill the truth!!]

Dee said...

You can email me a pix of the slot machine next to the buffet at the casino on Tulsa´s main drag.
This will prove to me you are from Tulsa.

Dee said...

Well actually, Sewell makes my point. The law, with all its racial profiling components, cause Hispanics and people of color to be reclusive. That is the terrible side effect of this Minuteman sponsored bill.

patriot said...

Minuteman sponsored bill? They are only Americans just like you and I. You act like they had some pull in the legislation, they didn't. I see you are on your MM hate kick again.

There is no need for Hispanic citizens to be reclusive. Illegal immigration has nothing to do with them unless they are like you and are an enabler.

People of color? Don't make me laugh, dee. No one is singled out simply because of the color of their skin. Mexicans for example, come with very light skin to very dark skin.

No matter what one's skin color is, if they are stopped by law enforcement for any reason, all they have to do is show their I.D. I have had to show my I.D. at least 3 times a one week for various reasons.

I see you are back on your race card kick again too. Dee, always repetitive over and over. Why don't you buy a parrot? He'd love you.

Anonymous said...

Dee -

i really don't understand your casino question - we have more than four casinos right here in Tusla - are you talking about the casino on riverside drive right by the playground / bicycle path - or the casino that is on the way to the airport

Again, each of the tribes here has their own casino -

any restaurants you want pictures of ? considering the jobs being created at restaurants here i would think you would want photos of some of your favorite tulsa restaurants - or perhaps some of the construction sites - plenty of construction jobs at the new arena being built downtown

again dee just set up your web site so i can post and i will

preferably a kitchen where blacks whites and latinos are all working together.

Dee said...

The one off of 44. Its the biggest one in Tulsa. Don´t you know this? Just email me the pix by the buffet.

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