Friday, September 12, 2008

Breaking News: Republican Scandal - Sex, Drugs, Oil - A Culture of Ethical Failure!

Do you wonder why gas prices are so high?
As many of us have suspected for some time, recent reports indicate the Bush Administration is up to its elbows in bed, literally and figuratively, with the Oil Companies, including Chevron, Shell, Hess and Williams Energy. The Office of Minerals Management Service (MMS), particularly the Royalty-in-Kind (RIK) Program (started in 2003) , where offshore drilling meets the U.S. government, has been caught up in a wide-ranging ethics scandal — including allegations of financial self-dealing, accepting gifts from energy companies, cocaine use and sexual misconduct. In three reports delivered to Congress on Wednesday, the department’s inspector general, Earl E. Devaney, found wrongdoing by a dozen current and former employees of the Minerals Management Service, which collects about $10 billion in royalties annually and is one of the government’s largest sources of revenue other than taxes.
Financial Self Dealing & Cronyism:
1. Lucy Q. Denett, the former associate director of minerals revenue management, worked with two aides to steer a lucrative consulting contract to one of the aides after he retired, violating competitive procurement rules. Ms. Denet´s husband is Paul A. Denett, who was the top procurement official in the White House Office of Management and Budget.
2. In late 2002, when he was about to retire, Mr. Jimmy Mayberry drafted a “statement of work” for a consulting contract to perform essentially identical functions to his own. He then retired, started a company, and in June 2003 won the contract with the help of Ms. Denett and Milton Dial, another friend at the agency.
3. Gregory W. Smith, program director of the royalty-in-kind program, improperly used his position with the royalty program to get an outside consulting job helping a technical services firm seek deals with oil and gas companies with which he was also conducting official business. The report also accused Mr. Smith of improperly accepting gifts from the oil and gas industry, of engaging in sex with two subordinates (including his secretary) and of using cocaine (which were called "office supplies") that he purchased from his secretary or her boyfriend several times a year between 2002 and 2005. He sometimes asked for the drugs and received them in his office during work hours.
4. A Chevron representative who had won a bid to purchase some of the government’s oil to pay taxpayers a lower amount than his winning offer because he said he made a mistake in his calculations. A report from Mr. Devaney’s office earlier this year found that the program frequently allowed companies that purchased the oil and gas to revise their bids downward after they won contracts. It documented 118 such occasions that cost taxpayers about $4.4 million.
5. One of the officials shared (inside) information about the confidential price a pipeline company was charging the government.
Lavish Expense Accounts:
Two other reports focus on “a culture of substance abuse and promiscuity” in the service’s Royalty-in-Kind (RIK) program. That part of the agency collects about $4 billion a year in oil and gas rather than cash royalties. Based in suburban Denver and modeled to operate like a private sector energy company, the royalty-in-kind program sells oil and gas on the open market. Its employees are subject to government ethics rules, such as restrictions on taking gifts from people and companies with whom they conduct official business. One of the reports says that the officials viewed themselves as exempt from those limits, indulging themselves in the expense-account-fueled world of oil and gas executives, “a pattern of abuses and mismanagement” costing taxpayers billions. The report also detailed cozy relationships between energy companies and other officials in the royalty-in-kind program office. Some 19 officials — a third of the staff — took gifts from oil and gas executives, some with “prodigious frequency,” it said.
Sex, Drugs, Ethics Violations
The report says that eight officials in the royalty program accepted gifts from energy companies whose value exceeded limits set by ethics rules — including golf, ski and paintball outings; meals and drinks; and tickets to a Toby Keith concert, a Houston Texans football game and a Colorado Rockies baseball game. The investigation also concluded that several of the officials “frequently consumed alcohol at industry functions, had used cocaine and marijuana, and had sexual relationships with oil and gas company representatives.”
The investigation separately found that the program’s manager mixed official and personal business. In sometimes lurid detail, the report also accuses him of having intimate relations with two subordinates, one of whom regularly sold him cocaine. The culture of the organization “appeared to be devoid of both the ethical standards and internal controls sufficient to protect the integrity of this vital revenue-producing program,” one report said. The director of the Minerals Management Service, Randall Luthi, said in a conference call with reporters that the officials implicated in the reports had violated the public’s trust.
1. Greg Smith, the assistant RIK program director, who, according to the inspector general's report, referred to "cocaine" as "office supplies" and who moonlighted for an environmental services firm that hired him to set up meetings with MMS clients, comes off as a one-of-a-kind wild man.
2. Two of the officials who marketed taxpayers’ oil got so drunk at a daytime golfing event sponsored by Shell that they could not drive to their hotels and were put up in Shell-provided lodging. Two female employees “engaged in brief sexual relationships with industry contacts.”
They said they did not view socializing with oil company representatives and taking gifts as inappropriate because they said they needed to be part of the marketing culture in order to market the program’s oil and gas.
About the MMS:
The Minerals Management Service is an agency within the Department of Interior, set up during the Reagan administration to manage natural mineral resources on the Outer Continental Shelf and some federal and Indian lands. MMS generates about $8 billion in revenue from leasing the rights to drill for oil and gas -- that's the single largest non-tax source of revenue for the federal government. MMS has two mechanisms for carving out that revenue. In the Royalty-in-Value program, it gets a cut off the top of whatever the oil companies are able to sell their mineral resources for. In the Royalty-in-Kind program -- which is where all the above abuses occurred -- the energy companies physically deliver oil and gas to MMS, which then pockets the proceeds from selling the goods itself. Of course, MMS does not actually own any transportation pipelines or storage facilities, so it has to contract out for these services from the private sector. Such a scenario carries with it obvious potential for conflicts of interest and corruption.
McCain and the Scandal:
Think about this every time you hear John McCain chant "drill, baby, drill." You might be familiar with the name of one of the oil companies lavishing gifts on MMS employees: the Hess Corp. You may recall that at precisely the moment that McCain recanted his long-held position against offshore drilling, he was showered with campaign contributions from Hess family members and company employees. I guess that's how the oil business works -- you pay off your government officials, and you get the contract.
References:

57 comments:

Anonymous said...

why does this surprise you? the pharma industry has a policy of hiring very young, attractive women to work as pharmaceutical sales reps.

These sales reps will sleep with the doctors they visit as a quid pro quo for the doctors writing prescriptions.

in many cases the drugs in question have identical efficacy (prozac vs zoloft) so the choice of one vs the other is determined by the "relationship" with the sales rep.

Dee said...

Anon,
It doesn´t srprise me.

What bothers me is the hyporcrisy of the Right. Your side advocates:
1. Rule of Law
2. Christian Values
3. American Values

and yet we have Sex, Drugs & Oil scandal, your pharmacy scandal. When I lived in MO, one of the biggest scandals we had was a pharmaceutical scandal. This right wing, christian conservative, church leader diluted the cancer medicines and pocketed the difference (millions) and he donated some of his proceeds to his church. Meanwhile thousands died due to placebos they received vs their prescribed medication.

It is the hypocrisy that makes me angry.

Dee said...

Anon,
I lived in Christian Conservative America. Rural America.
I remember driving miles and miles in the middle of nowhere and then coming up on a Gentleman´s Club loaded with prostitutes selling their stuff.

Prostitution, Gentleman´s Clubs, Sex Shops and Adult Video Stores THRIVE in Christian Conservative backwoods America.

I should have taken videos!!

Dee said...

We had BTK, a church leader, one of the most vicious serial killers in America, living in a Wichita Kansas neighboring small town.

He was a leader in his church!

The hypocrisy!!

Dee said...

The KC Pharmacist I referenced was Robert Courtney.

Here are articles about him if you are interesting in learning more about his heinous crimes.

Courtney:
one
two

patriot said...

So Democrats don't believe in the rule of law, Christian and American values? And yet, they don't have a lilly white past or present either. Your problem is painting with a broad brush those who call themselves Conservative Republicans as being hypocritical in nature. Sure there are some who are hypocrites just like many Democrats are also. I wouldn't give you a plug nickel for most politicians of either party. Lets look at the American public instead and stop thinking of them along political affiliations but rather human beings who sin no matter who they are.

Dee said...

Pat,
Here is what McCain said:
"I will veto every bill with pork barrel earmarks."

I say McCain is a LIAR!! It is his side that is the perpetrator. It is his side that participated in this sex, drugs, oil scandal. YET, he has the audacity to say, "I will veto.." Is just a LIE and the American Public should know about it!!

Anonymous said...

McCain will invite 40 million mexicans to move to the United States and become citizens of the US

Obama will invite 40 million mexicans to move to the united states and become citizens of the US

what is the difference?

Obama will let all 40 million collect welfare and McCain won't

choose wisely !

Liquidmicro said...

There are scandals on both sides of the aisles. Scandals are nothing new in politics, in fact one could almost call it human nature. To blame one side based on the actions of some, and hold no blame for the other side as well, now you have hypocrisy. There all in it for the money.

Anonymous said...

I just want to remind everyone that as much of a problem as illegal immigration is in the us we are not yet at the point where Europe is

in Sweden, immigration has led to a race war

(this is from gates of vienna)
I don’t have time to translate everything now, but I can give you a summary: This girl in the Swedish town of Södertälje was, along with her friend, brutally assaulted and beaten unconscious (they apparently continued beating her even after she was unconscious) by a group of more than twenty armed young men dressed in black. The attackers were of immigrant background (which the newspaper article actually states; they usually don’t mention this if it’s you-know-who) and screamed “f***ing Swedish whore!” while they beat the girl and her friend and kicked her while she was lying down.

The good part of the story is that another group of six young men (presumably native Swedes) intervened. That took real courage since they were badly outnumbered. They got badly beaten up, but probably saved the girl’s life.

This is all a part of the increasingly extreme sexual and physical violence targeting native white Swedes by immigrant gangs. This is way beyond just “crime,” it can hardly be labeled anything other than ethnic warfare.


____
At least here in the US the illegal immigrants are not at that level of violence against citizens

alie said...

I have relatives in Europe (not Sweden) and I have been aware of the out of control problem with immigration for some time.

In Sweden, the girls will sometimes dye their hair black so as not to attract attention of the Muslims.

The Swedes are among the most "tolerant" of people and this has worked against them as they are being taken advantage of now.

There are countries in Europe which are not push-overs. Italy is one of those places, particularly Southern Italy.

The indigenous peoples of Europe have the right to preserve their culture.

patriot said...

So what are you saying dee by implying that McCain is a liar in regards to "his side"? Are you saying that he speaks for all Republican politicians and all Republican Americans? I don't think so! You are using that broad brush again to demonize all Republicans.

Anonymous said...

Patriot,

the crucial issue facing our country is immigration.

There are two types of immigration that threaten our country

(1) immigration from latin america leading to eventual secession of the southwest from the USA

(2) immigration from muslim countries that leads to a huge fifth column inside the united states setting off suicide bomb attacks in major us cities

Of course you know this and i know this. But 80% of republicans are too focused on issues that are minor in comparison - like cutting taxes and having more religion in the public schools. Nonsense that won't really address the existential threats to the survival of our country.

So i don't hold you responsible, but i do regard the republican party as silly - republicans that understand the abyss we are heading in to are too lazy and or ineffective to steer their party in to doing anything about it.

McCain Palin will get elected, and they will give citizenship to the 15 million illegals and they will accelerate the pace of legal immigration from latin america and from muslim countries.

This is happening on the republicans' watch. History will remember the republican party for this

LMJ said...

"McCain Palin will get elected, and they will give citizenship to the 15 million illegals and they will accelerate the pace of legal immigration from latin america and from muslim countries."

Yeah they'll get elected, then right after that the war in Iraq will end, world peace will start, cure for cancer will be found, global warming will stabilize...

yeah that'll happen...

patriot said...

anon, this huge influx of illegal aliens mostly from south of our border started decades ago under both the Republican and Democrat watch.

If Obama wins the election I don't expect things to be any different on this issue then if McCain wins. Ultimately it will come down to congress being pushed to do the right thing and that is to secure our borders and take every step possible to remove illegal aliens from our midst. Enforecement in the workplace, cutting off benefits to them and re-interpreting the 14th Amendment will go a long ways in achieving this goal.

Nelson said...

In Sweden, the girls will sometimes dye their hair black so as not to attract attention of the Muslims.

Mexicans aren't Muslims.

Dee said...

Pat,
I do agree. Both Obama and McCain support CIR.
Obama has been upfront.
It is McCain who is squelching the discussion and having the YAFers hide their Fence signs. I hate the dishonesty. In the long run, I think he maintains this position because he supports businesses continuing to exploit workers.
Under McCain, nothing will change. Business will continue to hire illegal immigrants. The sweeps will continue. the Detention centers. This makes the workers more easily exploitable and shuts up the ANTIs for a while. Meanwhile the dollars keep rolling in for Business and the Contractors like Blackwater or the Private Prison owners. Talk about earmarks and dishonesty!!


patriot said...
If Obama wins the election I don't expect things to be any different on this issue then if McCain wins. Ultimately it will come down to congress being pushed to do the right thing and that is to secure our borders and take every step possible to remove illegal aliens from our midst. Enforecement in the workplace, cutting off benefits to them and re-interpreting the 14th Amendment will go a long ways in achieving this goal.

Dee said...

Pat,
And I am NOT saying it is ALL Republicans. It is Bush and McCain. McCain will bring in 4 more years of Bushonomics and War!!

patriot said...

Dee, you act like I am supporting McCain and I am not! I have no use for him and will not vote for either him or Obama.

As far as him objecting to the signs "build the fence" it was all to pander to the Hispanic vote. He was duping your side and I am sure many Hispanics were fooled by it, thinking "ok he is on our side." While I still have high hopes that he will secure the border, I wouldn't doubt that he tries to push another amnesty along with it just like Obama will do. The thing they are hoping the public forgets is that they don't have the power to do that! Only congress does! It is some of the pro-illegal Hispanics who are being fooled not the anti side!

patriot said...

In otherwords dee, we anti-illegal Republicans and Democrats know what McCain is up to but he is fooling many pro-illegals.

Anonymous said...

The difference between america and Sweden is as follows

in Sweden the immigrants are on a vicious violent crime spree against anglos (just google "gang rape epidemic sweden" for many on the ground reports)

In America the immigrants are on a vicious violent crime spree against blacks (google "Jamiel Andre Shaw" )

Anglos only care about other anglos that is why immigrant crime is on the radar screen in Sweden and not on the radar screen in America.

Republicans agree 100% with Dee - republicans and Dee team up to bring in millions of illegals from Mexico.

On this site Dee pretends to have disagreements with the republicans but off line of course Dee and the McCain republicans are on the same side - the side of bringing plenty more illegals in from Mexico.

Anonymous said...

Star L.A. athlete couldn’t outrun gangs
March 04, 2008

Stanford University called about Jamiel Shaw a week or so ago, intrigued by the slight but speedy running back for Los Angeles High School, the Southern League’s most valuable player last year. Rutgers University called a few days later.

The Shaw family already had reason to be proud. Jamiel’s mother, Army Sgt. Anita Shaw, was on her second tour of duty in Iraq.

On Sunday night, it was Jamiel’s father on the phone and then his son’s girlfriend, Chrystale Miles. Jamiel Sr. called to tell him to hurry home from the mall. The 17-year-old boy was three doors away when someone shot him to death while he was still talking on his cellphone to Chrystale, friends say.

Jamiel Sr. heard the shots almost as soon as he hung up. He ran out of the house, raced around the corner and found his son lying on the sidewalk, bleeding.

“She’s over there trying to protect us from guns and bombs, and then she has to hear that her son is dead over here,” he said of Anita on Monday. “I’ve got my own personal Iraq now.”

Los Angeles police officials described the killing as random and senseless, cutting down a youth who had been doing everything right in his life – from hitting the books to never missing church to inspiring the Los Angeles High Romans to last year’s Southern League title.

A police spokeswoman said two Latino men killed Jamiel
_____________

His blood is on Dee's hands

patriot said...

Anon, if you expect dee to get all worked over Jamiel's killing like she did over the Latino boy who got beat up and died at the hands of some anglo boys, you have a long wait.

ultima said...

I suspect the scandal here in Denver had little to do with which political party the participants belonged to and there were probably some of each having fun.

Corruption is everywhere. It's just convenient to blame it on the other guy or the other party.

I believe McCain will veto pork but that's no big deal because the pork projects always have huge bi-partisan support and a veto should be easy to override.

The pedophile scandals in the Catholic church suggest that if you live in a glass house, one should not throw stones.

I predict that Obama will win the election because of his huge war chest and the organizing power of the relative youth and energy of some of his supporters not to say his oratorical abilities. I furter predict that he will propose another stupid CIR bill and that congress will go along after intense debate. That will seal the fate of our country.

In the stilted language of business, government, and journalism, “diverse” has come to mean “nonwhite” but its actual meaning is “made up of distinct characteristics, qualities, or elements”. There is no denying that today’s immigration is radically less diverse than in the past. Although today’s immigrants are from every corner of the world, this masks a growing domination of the immigrant flow by one ethnic group. Mexicans now account for some 31 percent of the total immigrant population—legal, illegal, naturalized and noncitizen—and for fully 43 percent of the growth in the total immigrant population in the 1990s. The 12 million Mexican immigrants are more than the number of people from the next 10 countries of origin combined. When you add in the non-Mexican Hispanic immigrants, the diversity of this immigration flow is significantly less than the above figures suggest.

Something for all those who like to tout diversity in America to think about. Something for all those who don't accept that Mexifornia is a state becoming. It is unlikely that the change in America will be limited to the Southwest. If Obama or McCain has his way, we will be on the path to Mexico Norte. The immigration statistics cited above make it inevitable. Every new Hispanic voter will make it more difficult to reverse this trend and eventually I am sad to say we will reach that critical mass of Hispanic voters so that no one can be elected president without catering to their every demand. And, of course, there will be more and more Hispanic congressmen and women to do the bidding of their Hispanic constituents.

Given current trends, it is hard for me to see any other outcome. And certainly the pro-illegals will have to accept a share a major part of the blame for this, if not for their disloyalty for their prodigious myopia.

ultima said...

Surely you don't want concede Christian values to the right; there must be some on the left who found Catholic christian value pedophile's behavior objectionable just as those on the right find deviant behavior among its member disgusting.

Anon has it right about the pharm reps. I even saw in defense plants where I worked as the contractors used good-looking babes to try to influence young Air Force officers to sign off on deviations from the drawings and specification -- sometimes while crossing and uncrossing their legs in a very seductive way. Most saw through this ploy and wanted no part of it nevertheless you could count on whenever there was a major engineering review every Air Force officer had a good looking secretary for a dinner companion, no wives were present (probably didn't have the requisite security clearance among other obvious reasons).

Anonymous said...

Ultima
I am very sad to say that you are right.

Our country is made up of immigrants from around the world, and the children and grandchildren of immigrants from around the world.

Almost every immigrant group that has come here in the past 300 years has assimilated and become patriotic.

The armed forces of our country have volunteers whose grandparents came from many nations.

Let us not forget that the grandchildren of German immigrants living in the midwest had no problem landing on the beaches at DDay and shooting Germans. Similar story with other groups - once they have become American they have stayed loyal to our country.

I believe that many fine folks who moved to the US from Mexico 100 years ago have blended in to our nation, mixed with other groups, and become completely American.

The sad thing is that small numbers of ispanish speaking immigrants could be well absorbed in to our nation today and over the coming decade.

It is the massive number streaming in that really dooms America - the numbers are so overwhelming that there really is no chance for American culture, morals or society to live on. We are and will continue to be swamped.

The majority of Americans have lost the will to see our culture survive. And as a result it will not survive.

Dee's victory is well and truly complete.

For those of us that want our grandchildren to grow up in a nation that embodies the values of Western civilization and the enlightenment, as opposed to the tribal dysfunctional latin american values, i wonder where we should move to. As an english speaker i believe the choices include Canada, New Zealand, or Australia. None of those places is perfect, but I think all of them will be more similar intellectually and culturally to the America we all loved, as compared to what is coming.

The question is, will Canada, Australia, or New Zeland allow us refugees from the collapsing latinizing United States to immigrate?

patriot said...

Ultima and anonymous, all very good points and painfully true. I have considered moving to Canada myself since it is nearby. I don't wish to live in a dominant Hispanicized country resembling Mexico. It wouldn't feel like home anymore.

Dee said...

Anon,
You have gone off the deep end again, as usual.
There are millions of Americans who are Hispanic descendant that have lived in America for hundreds of years, as my family has. We are as American as Apple Pie. We are very patriotic and we have many military families, many now serving in Iraq, defending you and me.

Yes there was a recent influx of newer Latino immigrants, both legal and illegal, all at the request of Business and the Admininstration, here to work. Given time, they will assimilate, as all of us have.

It generally takes a generation to assimilate.

We had a friend, Ulty and I, from another board, named Lupita. She called me and other American Latinos "gringos." We are not Mexican. WE are Americans. Our ethnicity is Latino.

Now stop your little scare tactics and go back to being civil. Your scare tactics do not become you.

Dee said...

Oh Pat,
You know as well as I do you will never move to Canada.
Now quit it!

patriot said...

Bet me!

patriot said...

If you are an example of being as American as apple pie, dee. I will toss my citizenship papers into the nearest river.

Anonymous said...

Patriot,

As an american i would like to obtain dual citizenship with Canada, that way if things go to heck here in America i have the option of moving to Canada.

Do you know how hard it is ?

Dee said...

Pat,
You will not throw your citizenship papers in the nearest river. I will bet you on that.

Dee said...

Ultima,
You and I both know that both McCain and Obama support CIR. That is a given. However, I dont see how either of them will get CIR passed given the opposition they face in Congress. Therefore, we will probably continue with status quo.
If we put the Immigration discussion aside, the top two issues are the War and the Economy. McCain, if elected, will continue with 4 more of the last 8 years. No one wants that!

Alie said...

My God, Ultima, Anonymous, and Patriot--as a young American I feel like ending it all after reading your posts! Are we truly doomed to become a replica of Latin America and all of their dysfunction? This thought is truly depressing!

I wonder how things are in Australia. I have read that they are standing up for their culture there. I don't think they could take all of us there, though.

One thing is that after this country turns into Mexico, the immigration problem will be solved as nobody will want to come here anymore.

Alie said...

Hispanics as well as other immigrants assimilated in the past because their numbers were not overwhelming and there was pressure to assimilate. It was expected.

Many of the Latinos who are agitating for amnesty today are those who have relatives here who are illegal. Many of these legal Latinos are those who gained amnesty in 1986, then brought in their relatives illegally. Now, what do you suppose will happen with another amnesty for not 3 million now, but 12 - 20 million? They will bring in more relatives and then demand amnesty for them in a few years. At that point, like Ultima said, they will have so much political power that no politician will dare to speak against open borders with Mexico/Latin America. Our sovereignty will be a thing of the past and we will merely become Mexico el Norte for all practical purposes. There will be no need for Latinos to assimilate; at that point, they will demand that we all assimilate to THEM.

Remember that the U.S. restricted massive immigration from Eastern and Southern Europe in 1924. One of the results of stopping the flow from these areas is that it gave the new immigrants and the subsequent generation a better chance to assimilate. This was good for the immigrants and good for the country.

Our country cannot continue to absorb and assimilate an unending flow of immigrants from South of the border. This is simply common sense.

Anonymous said...

Alie
of course you are right

what no one on this board has pointed out - never in the history of this board - is that amnesty for the 20 million illegals doesn't really matter.

The 20 million illegals are having babies here in America. On average, each illegal couple from Mexico has three kids. And then the kids have kids of their own on average at the age of 19. At that rate of reproduction, the population descended from the illegals grows exponentially.

That is why the population of the USA is projected to grow by more than 100 million so quickly - it is caused by the massive number of children and grandchildren being produced by the immigrants from Mexico.

There is so much talk on this blog about amnesty vs no amnesty. Amnesty doesn't matter - the 20 million will have plenty of kids whether they are citizens or not.
And the kids are American citizens

Simply by sneaking across the border and having lots of kids here in America, the fine folks from Mexico have won control of the United States. The demographic changes are coming. That is why in many ways Obama and McCain are both smart to be so loudly pro - Mexican.

They both realize that in the future this will be a latin country and the history books will be written from a latin or mexican perspective. The anti amnesty forces will be portrayed in a very negative light. Obama and McCain just both want to be remembered by history as good guys and the only way to insure that is to go on record as being pro amnesty.

the battle is over and Dee has won. The only consolation we have is that as the USA turns in to Mexico norte, Dee will realize what a hellhole her grandchildren will be living in, a fate that she and the others who pushed for the influx of mexicans in to the united states have created.

Dee's grandchildren have lost the opportunity to grow up in a country like the one she grew up in

alie said...

Anonymous, I'm not sure all is lost yet.

The latest population projections show that at mid-century Latinos will still only comprise 25% of the population. And keep in mind that someone who is only 1/4 Latino could still be counted as "Latino."

I've seen the Latinos boasting about their impending "take over" of this country, and I believe their celebration is premature. Whites will still be almost 50% of the population at that point, with the other 50% being divided up amongst other groups. It looks as though there will be no "majority" just a lot of "minorities." As well, surely at least some of those counted as Latinos are assimilated and do not want to turn this country into Mexico.

So I think we could still stop this nonsense if we got serious about it. End the flagrant abuse of the 14th amendment. Reading the debates leading up to the passage of that amendment makes it clear that it was NEVER intended for the purpose of illegals sneaking in here and producing children which would become automatic citizens.

Reinterpreting the 14th amendment would apply to ANY illegal from ANY nationality/race/ethnic group and so cannot be construed as racist in any way. It would merely return this country to sanity.

patriot said...

allie and anon, you have made many good points and I agree with much of what you have said. It is the cold hard truth! Bet dee either remains silent on it or comes in here to spin it as usual. She refuses to see the truth.

ultima said...

" I dont see how either of them will get CIR passed given the opposition they face in Congress."

I think you are overlooking two things: the complexion of congress is likely to change rather dramatically with the upcoming election. If candidates are able to ride the coattails of a successful Obama, the Republicans and other who oppose CIR will be unable to garner enough votes to even thwart cloture. The vote was close before. After the November election it will be impossible to stop this freight train and we will have CIR and Mexico Norte jammed down our throats. Perhaps you will recall that a number of Republicans have chosen not to run for re-election making it even easier for the CIR crowd to make inroads into whatever checks and balances existed before. Sorry to be a prophet of gloom and doom but I have to call 'em the way I see 'em. The emperor has no clothes.

ultima said...

There are millions of Americans who are Hispanic descendant that have lived in America for hundreds of years, as my family has. We are as American as Apple Pie. We are very patriotic and we have many military families, many now serving in Iraq, defending you and me.

"Yes there was a recent influx of newer Latino immigrants, both legal and illegal, all at the request of Business and the Admininstration, here to work. Given time, they will assimilate, as all of us have.

It generally takes a generation to assimilate."

Actually all of you haven't. This has been documented many times in Texas, New Mexico and California. Why assimilate when all your neighbors are Mexicans and speak only or mostly Spanish. Why assimilate if you can watch all of your favorite programs on Telemundo or Azteca? Why assimilate to a foreign culture when you are more comfortable in your own? Why assimilate if you can move or communicate across the border to your homeland and your relatives with ease? Why assimilate if you can get all the benefits of a generous America without doing so? Why assimilate if you can get an education and a job without doing so?

I am afraid you have grossly underestimated the problem and your great great grandchildren won't even know how wrong you were because they will think America has always been just another Latin American country.

If having blinders on about all of this is as American as apple pie, you must be living in a dream world.

Mass immigration in this day of quick communication and travel is totally inconsistent and incompatible with asssimilation.

ultima said...

"I dont see how either of them will get CIR passed given the opposition they face in Congress. Therefore, we will probably continue with status quo."

This where the Hispanic community could begin to show that they are as American as apple pie -- by demanding that Obama/McCain secure our borders and pursue a relentless policy of vigorous and continuous internal enforcement to reinforce the concept of secure borders. Once Hispanics support secure borders and effective internal enforcement maybe the congress will get the message after all it is the Hispanics that will control their political destinies and the destiny of our beloved country.

Dee said...

Alie,
Now you are making things up.
First, most of us that you say are "agitating for amnesty" are actually supporting CIR.
Second, most Latinos I know who support CIR are like me. Their families have been here hundreds of years, longer than your ancestors.

Beyond CIR, we particularly want the end to Racial Profiling, the end to the ICE Raids and the End to Detention Centers!


Alie said...
Many of the Latinos who are agitating for amnesty today are those who have relatives here who are illegal.

Dee said...

Alie,
Now you are making things up.
First, most of us that you say are "agitating for amnesty" are actually supporting CIR.
Second, most Latinos I know who support CIR are like me. Their families have been here hundreds of years, longer than your ancestors.

Beyond CIR, we particularly want the end to Racial Profiling, the end to the ICE Raids and the End to Detention Centers!


Alie said...
Many of the Latinos who are agitating for amnesty today are those who have relatives here who are illegal.

Dee said...

Now you have really lost it Anon. My grandsons are talented, brilliant young boys who are growing into fine young men. With education and sports background I am absolutely positive they will be future leaders in our country.

As my father said, the key to a successful future is Education and Family. I have passed my father´s insights on to my children and grandchildren.

America will be fine! We need to stop fighting with each other and help push Education and the end to Drugs, especially Meth!


Anonymous said
Dee's grandchildren have lost the opportunity to grow up in a country like the one she grew up in

Dee said...

Ulty,
I think the issue is the word Assimilation. Your interpretation is different than mine.

Your definition is all of us turning into a white northern european colony, ala Mayberry. Aunt Bee sitting in the kitchen waiting for her apple pie to finish baking.

We have evolved from Mayberry. There never was any such thing as Mayberry. Maybe you pretend to remember it, but it was just a TV show.

We are no longer the Pilgrims either.

We have many cultures in America. Go from your nice cozy, techno savvy living room to any poverty stricken, drug infested urban area like Denver, Detroit, KC or DC (or any metro urban area). Are they assimilated in these areas? Do the dropouts speak the perfect English you want them to speak? Is that smell from the kitchen apple pie? What about the remote towns that have become Meth addicted? The zoned out, agitated Meth addicts who can barely put a sentence together, scratching and looking for their next fix. Is that assimilated to you? It is the same here in the Dallas area, the cushy burbs to the urban blight. None of these are Immigration issues.

We have poverty issues and drug issues in America that are much more severe and dire to our society than immigrant workers looking for a job, struggling to learn English at night.

patriot said...

You are full of cacca as usual, dee. This country was once 90% white, so yes Mayberry did exist on a grand scale at one time. It still exists in many little communities and towns. You just can't stand that concept because it isn't Maybarrio instead, therefore you deny its existance. Sticking your head in the sand about it because you hate the majority white anglo culture is just plain racist and hateful.

Only someone with a cold heart would advocate stripping a country of its traditional culture and society by replacing it with a foreign one. You are only an American on paper, your heart is pure Mexican! Please move to Maybarrio to the south of us, thanks!

alie said...

No, Dee, I am not making things up. Many legal Hispanics either had parents or grandparents who were illegals, and thus sympathize with illegals, or they have family members--siblings, parents, aunts, uncles, cousins--who are here illegally. Why you would deny this is beyond all comprehension to me.

Yes some of them are like you and just advocating for illegals because the majority are ethnically like themselves, but for many it is a personal issue.

Dee said...

Pat,
Mayberry only exists on TV Land at 9pm central 10 Eastern on most weeknights. Tune in.

PS: Do you have any resemblance to ole Barn?

Dee said...

Alie,
Like so many on your side, your ASS-U-mptions! are all based on your own opinions!
It really is very, very sad!



alie said...
No, Dee, I am not making things up. Many legal Hispanics either had parents or grandparents who were illegals, and thus sympathize with illegals, or they have family members--siblings, parents, aunts, uncles, cousins--who are here illegally. Why you would deny this is beyond all comprehension to me.

Yes some of them are like you and just advocating for illegals because the majority are ethnically like themselves, but for many it is a personal issue.

Liquidmicro said...

Seems the only one doing the ASS-U-ming here Dee, is you.

Survey: Latinos say their situation in U.S. is getting worse

"A large majority of Latinos oppose measures to crack down on illegal immigration through workplace raids and criminally prosecuting employers who hire unauthorized workers.

Eighty-one percent of Latinos say immigration enforcement should be left mainly to federal authorities rather than local police or sheriffs' departments, according to the survey.

"It's morally wrong to pick out one ethnic group as the enemy. That's what they're doing with these illegitimate raids," said Thomas Gonzalez, a 20-year-old Bloomington native who is studying political science at UC Santa Barbara. "To separate a U.S. citizen child from their parents just because they're undocumented, it clearly doesn't make sense."

There also is a slight increase over last year in the number of Latinos who worry about deportation. Forty percent say they worry a lot and an additional 17 percent say they are concerned that they, a family member or close friend may be deported, the survey says.

"In our extended families, Latinos either have somebody that has no documents or we know somebody that has no documents," said Emilio Amaya, executive director of the San Bernardino Community Service Center, a nonprofit that provides immigration and other services to Latinos. "Obviously, we feel the impact of any immigration enforcement in the community."

Amaya said enforcement measures don't distinguish between legal and illegal immigrants.

"When it comes to trying to single out an immigrant, if it's a Latino, there's no way to really say if somebody is a U.S. citizen or has no documents. We all look the same," Amaya said."

patriot said...

As I said dee, you just can't stand the fact that this country has a majority white population and its identity and culture is that of white-anglo European. There are many towns and areas of this country where they have not suffered the illegal Latino invasion and they remain dominantly of the culture that this country was melted into and founded on. You are seething with hatred that we have not become a dominantly Hispanic country yet so you deny that anglo culture is still the dominant one.

There are no assumptions on Alie's part. She nailed it. Hispanics like you who are pro-illegal are that way because the majority of illegals are Hispanic like yourself. The sooner you start being honest about it, the better for you to debate honestly about this issue.

Dee said...

Liquid,
The survey is saying what I am saying. PROs are PROs because they disagree with:
. Detention Centers
. Racial Profiling
. Ice Raids

Alie is saying most PROs are illegal or know someone illegal and thats why they are PROs.
Alie said:
Many of the Latinos who are agitating for amnesty today are those who have relatives here who are illegal.

Dee said...

Liquid,
It would help if you comprehend what the man you quoted is saying!
He is AGAINST RACIAL PROFILING!!!

Quote in the article Liquid provided:
"When it comes to trying to single out an immigrant, if it's a Latino, there's no way to really say if somebody is a U.S. citizen or has no documents. We all look the same," Amaya said."

Liquidmicro said...

I was pointing out to what Alie stated. I gave proof of what she said, you must have missed it.

""In our extended families, Latinos either have somebody that has no documents or we know somebody that has no documents," said Emilio Amaya, executive director of the San Bernardino Community Service Center, a nonprofit that provides immigration and other services to Latinos. "Obviously, we feel the impact of any immigration enforcement in the community.""

Liquidmicro said...

Your comprehension skills today must be waning.

patriot said...

1. Detention centers are necessary to house illegal aliens as they are caught just like jails and prisons are necessary for American law violators. What does one suggest, that we treat illegal aliens special? Sometimes the children are housed with their parents to keep them together as a family. Yet the pro illegal hypocrites keep screaming "separation of families"!

2.Racial profiling....Call it what you want but during the course of ANY investigation law enforcement would seek out those who most likely fit the description of the criminals. If one isn't guilty of anything then they have nothing to fear by being questioned. It is one of the most ridiculous arguments that the pros use.

3. ICE raids....and just what is the problem with that? See my comments under number 1. We don't have the right to enforce our immigration laws? How so?

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